Name: Laggarbo Forest Garden
Owners: Christina Schaffer, Per Klingberg
Location: Kopparberg, ÖrebroSwedish hardiness Zone 4
Established: 2012
Property: size 6 hectares, small forest garden experiment started 60sq m and expanded to 200sq m.
Main activities: exploration of agroforestry mainly forest garden, edible landscape, testing of varieties of nuts, apples and other fruits, bee hives, kitchen garden etc.
Biggest challenge: to find suitable ground cover plants for the forest garden, and how to keep pests like squirrels, jay away from the hazelnut groove.
Research project: 2012-16 we participated in a research project as 1 out of 12 farms across Sweden on agroforestry (including silvoarable system, silvopastoral systems and forest gardens) in which every farm did 60m2 with the same design and plants.
Other: Great variation in topography.
Chapters:
00:00 Laggarbo Forest Garden
00:57 What is your profession?
08:19 What were the feelings after a couple of years?
09:26 Severe drought in 2018
10:56 Which species have worked really well?
13:18 How do you manage without a fence?
16:18 Bad location for Pirja apple
18:44 Why did you plant the mulberry here?
21:26 Can you tell us how you plant a tree?
23:13 Nursery
24:04 How often do you irrigate the plantings?
28:37 Good location for Pirja apple
29:03 How do you use the fruits?
30:00 Do you fertilize the fruit trees?
31:12 Have you noticed the effects of climate change?
32:05 What is the soil type?
33:04 Apple Garden
34:14 The story of finding the perfect apple, Kavlås
36:29 Nut Garden no. 1
37:38 Do you prune the hazels?
37:49 What is your favourite hazel cultivar?
38:36 Do you have to plant the hazelnuts in protective wire cages against voles?
39:42 Do rabbits or hares eat hazel branches?
41:15 How do you fertilize your annual garden?
42:07 Nut Garden no. 2
44:16 How old are these big hazels?
45:14 Have you seen the nut weevil in your garden?
46:25 How do you collect the nuts?
47:33 Any deer or moose damage?
48:02 Moose Garden
48:47 Park
50:42 Pear crafted to Rowan (Pärrön)
52:04 Mistakes and lessons learnt in your garden?
53:40 Your advice for anyone who wants to establish a forest garden?
55:53 Thank You!
🌿 🍎 🌱 🌼 🍐 🍑 🌳 🍇 🍃 🌰 🌲 🌰 🍃 🍇 🌳 🍑 🍐 🌼 🌱 🍎 🌿
🌳 The Food Forest Tour 2023
A small Finnish group embarked on a week-long study trip to Sweden to explore forest gardens. The group included experts and enthusiasts in the field. The route extended from central Sweden to southern Sweden.
The gardens we visited were all created from different perspectives, with great enthusiasm and love for engaging with nature as a common factor. Each destination also showcased Permaculture design. Altogether we visited 9 private Forest Gardens and three public parks with a Forest Garden.
💭 Why did we make this tour?
To see advanced Food Forests and Forest Gardens, gather knowledge on the subject, network with Swedish Forest Gardeners and share these special places by videos for enthusiasts.
🎯 Tour destinations:
01 Malmabergsparken med Matskogen – Vesterås
02 Puttmyra Skogsträdgården – Stjärnsund
03 Christina Schaffer och Per Klingbergs Skogsträdgård – Kopparberg
04 Gyttorpsskolan – Örebro
06 Eklunden Park – Örebro
07 Skogsträdgården Holma – Höör
08 Skogsträdgårdens Växter – Höör
09 Skoglundarna Hampus – Östaröd
10 Lilla Skräddaröd – Rörum Skåne
11 Anders Agroforestry – Rydeholm
12 Åfallet – Haddebo
👓 About the filming crew:
Juha Ujula teaches Horticulture, Agroforestry and Forest Gardening at LIVIA College in SW Finland. Specialized in introducing new edible & ornamental plants, he’s worked at Mustila Arboretum and Botanical Garden of Turku. At the moment Juha and his partner, Laura are living a quiet life in the countryside, growing veggies, herbs, medicinals and edible nursery plants.
Visa Suonpää working in the field of art, combines a permacultural approach into his artistic practices. Best known as a member of artist duo IC-98.
Sari Nousiainen practices homesteading on her 5-hectare family farm. She has a Forest Garden and practices small-scale agroforestry. At the farm she manages an annual vegetable garden and greenhouse, sheep, ducks and bees together with her husband. Her occupation is webmaster and her hobby is video editing. Her own Youtube channel is @vahkajakkara.
Walk around and and you get a feeling of how how we started out yes that’s the most interesting because as I said we bought this place 2008 we had been looking in the area and we were looking for a house just like that but we got six houses and six
Hectars because we fell in love with this place immediately it was love at first sight really and and we have been talking about it in the terms of well actually you cannot buy happiness but well maybe you can after after being here for all these years now it’s uh it’s heartfelt and and
We really love it what do I really do yes I I’m a psychologist okay so I work work with Psychotherapy individuals and couples but you here to hear about Agro forestry and when we bought it 2008 I haven’t heard the term even so it was my
Wife but she is the one who who is doing the doctorate on on this so she came home from a conference and and it was about 2 11 I think or 12 uh what do you say could you be willing to start something called Agro forestry uh well why
Not so uh then where there were three Farms here in this region called n from that conference that was willing to start this project to to on a small area start for farming and trying to get biodiversity carbon B binding and whatever things you could find from this little as on a small
Place so uh we started in a small scale before this uh uh we actually got funding for doing this uh in Academic Way with all these 12 so we started a little bit that is the only uh thing we actually have bought in terms of
Soil we bought one big heap of soil when we started to uh create this Garden Of course uh doing it in the first time this is a little stick and this is a little stick well maybe 3 m seems very empty in between but you will see we we had a bad planning
You recognize this one s sason yeah uh and there are other guys who are recognizing this one as well all the trash TR and you know they they they ripe differently but they pick Only The Ripe ones so we don’t get a lot of uh berries
From this one they they take nearly all of it this Inner Circle here starting with this sasone actually that is the the plant material that these 12 Gardens shared and and we we the plan was to see how can we what can this little uh area
Produce and and we were planning how to put them out and we were for three years actually we were one year we were planning and for two years more we had fundings for for this experiment of all the 12 Gardens I would say this is the one that has uh
Uh is still working as as a farest go all the others uh the Sana yeah yeah yeah took took the apple trees uh the hands took all the others and I mean they since we have so large area areas it was in retrospect rather silly
Excuse me to to put uh uh all the material in in such a small area but but it was for us to experiment and and that was very very interest because there was a lot of for us totally new plants that we have never heard of before and and of
Course you have heard this that you actually plant them so they will give uh all the nutritions that they need together so and that has been very very interesting but the big problem is the layer in between Mark Tek we have we have not found anything I
Mean you know the the the workfree garden blah blah blah no I have not seen anything like that so uh uh the Big Trees uh the climers the small bushes very easy but to find out how to manage and then this is so small it’s only 60 square uh
Met so I mean this is actually yeah mean for for a normal Garden this is fine but if you have six hectars why would you do that like this so this is a starting point uh at at uh after 3 four years I I was ready to give
Up because I could not find a way I mean it just looked messy and then we started to to start from the beginning we started with uh cutting down the uh the grass putting on uh papers again and starting to grow one years you I mean potato and things like
So we covered the areas that we had not found any good ground cover so this is how it looks now it is uh what we have uh learn to appreciate very very much see M Thorn yes exactly uh and this uh is a very very sweet
One compared to the one behind you VI that is you call it turny turn turn turn this is from bloomist okay and it’s so sour it’s not eatable the sweet one is Swedish cultiv oh very very nice you you know the the the long Thorns here when you have
A she take a nail scissor and cut off all the the long thorns and then you can pick them uh mini Ki you have there uh the grapes and uh this seab back torn uh the hazelnuts and three different apple trees um quins you know Quon yeah there
Is a small Rosen Quon so that is the basic plant material in this uh for this 12 Gardens and then we have a yeah different kinds on on the different places we we got very inspired we met a lot of people uh it was very interesting uh conversations around this subject of
Self-sufficiency and and food security and I mean it was also you can call it some kind of a political agenda that was for us both of us very interesting and then I mean 60 square meters of strange uh things together then then we went yeah for me what was the first
Thing to happen but I was very interested in in apples and and started to pruning and started to you can see here and we started to put on out some trees that because then I know they will produce if there is not like summer 2018 when they will drop in because they
Have no water so that that was also a very strong game changer for US 20 18 uh because we had only a digged well here and it got completely dry we had a small pond already died there completely dry uh we had not bought all these big
Tanks to collect uh rainwater at that time so I mean if you call get the feeling of really getting stuck I mean okay i’ I’ve never experienced anything like that and and it was actually fear when you s he heard the planes you know coming from Poland and because there were many
Huge forest fires in the far north I it was like experience some kind of War like experience and actually I mean everything every time it was a thunderstorm well will it will it will it catch fire somewhere that that was Heavy uh and and after that we with our
First decision was we we have to drill for water we we cannot depend on the this if if this will happen again uh the grass in between no but it was strange because some of the plant material you see this this uh U apple tree here it was first it was uh
Falsely named it is not the one that is on on the the tag and it it was very uh first winter the the hair the rabber yes eat the bark so it it did not grow very well but the one that has been developed most is
The Hazel I would say we had also what you call this am Trad the nourishing uh tree uh but I have cut it down very strongly now but it’s an all there for for for nutrition and the old apple tree that it it was there already it was part of it but
Uh the location uh and and the position to the south I mean we have South also Southwest the inlow of uh uh sunshine I think that it it’s very well placed in that s so so with that will and as I told you earlier it’s so close by and
Now when it so lushy I mean this place it it’s very nice to sit here it’s uh uh Pro productive I would say no not very productive carbon binding well there are but better ways to bind carbon absolutely I would say but uh uh the experimentation the connections and the
Uh ideas is what has has grown best I would say uh in a sense because I mean we will we will look at what has come out of it in other ways than this specific uh concentrated way of it the first years when when they were
Very small we we had uh fans around it uh uh but uh I forgot fans you know bark on on that one uh I’ve not done that mistake more this year and you will see I have more I more than I think 70 fruit trees here only this road gives a lot of strange winds yeah uh so what when it was very very early
In uh in the way it came very strong winds from that side the AL grass the the white ones it was down here it was like a swamp only mhm and uh so so we have no we we will just dig it out and the the water stays
There yeah so fruits Hazel and we have also tried other nuts you will see up here so that is an outcome of this because in the uh in what you say phase two some of the people in this uh group of 12 12 Gardens went to uh England and and
And on on a nut course we had three three-day course course with with craford amazing so so there we we found found out which hazelnuts could work well in this area so then you will see up there then we had seven different uh hazelnuts uh I have around each uh route I have
Net but still I have a chicken net I have not this kind of huge uh that Philip has I have chicken at Double okay and then I you know put it up around like this so they can’t come in that way I I always do that but sometimes it’s not enough
Obviously so during you know we had a very very dry period here be before the rain comes now so th this was nearly uh empty even this one and the small one was completely empty so we have had thanks God uh very good rains coming the last three weeks
Peria not a very good place but the pond has been a very interesting thing because uh you the biodiversity if we are talking about the that specifically we have had through the the last four years we have a total uh we about 200 frogs coming here and it’s so lovely to
Hear around here for one week gone so the the small pond and this one so that that is also a great uh pleasure over Joy when when you see that you dig a hole and they find it and also birds find finding this so here are uh just
For last year five new apple trees so this is one kind of expansion that came from this project uh more of a fruit Garden and uh the the soil here is very rich in calcium so we have in the in the spring we have you know
Bla animon white and blue and uh lily of the valley huge and and there’s also this that that I remember from my childhood it’s a uh yellow ball doll DOA say and I have not seen them in many places but they were also here when we
Came uh here we have uh one uh effect of 2018 I think uh you see we have a wonderful big one here and and one next to it has been sick and here you can also see that they’re getting sick uh and we don’t know what to do it’s just
Is it it just happens so th this one was the first Little Pond uh but here you have Mulla that was very deliberate the South the heat from the pond and and getting enough with the water from the dam they are so ripe so they just fall and they
Are totally lovely biodiversity but also uh having a lot of different species especially last year it was a very very very good thing because uh I don’t know why but there were no Runar then this Runar morand were taking all the apples so I mean we we you know we have
About 70 fruit trees we got no apples they were all and the squirrel took all the hazelnuts very very efficient picking every one of them and he picked them before they were ripe so we we were not even thinking about picking them yet but but then we we have the plums we
Had this one really getting giving a lot we have blueberries we have the lingam berries and and uh rasberries we have lots of rasberries so I mean you lose some you but if you have the this diversity it it works out anyway but talking about craford almost
Uh I mean he’s very peaceful and the anle man in s say but when it comes to squirrels and nuts then he said you have to choose if you want to have nuts or if you want to have squirrels so so he had a lot of traps
For them and also uh actually shooting them and in and in his book uh when he has a lot of recipes uh grilled squirrel is one of the recipes in it and I’m considering to to to to use it uh another uh you see the these big
Tanks you this is a huge roof I mean you get a lot of when it rins you get immediately a full tank there yes I dig a hole Yeah and then I put in the net and then we have a leaf compost here so uh little bit of ordinary soil
And this compost soil and and and a little bit of the soil I dig out and it’s bit like M and and a mount and and and I cover it about 1 met with uh some plastic cover so so the grass especially for the fruit trees and the
Plastic the the the competition between their roots and the grass uh that is what what Le says mhm I mean you you get them to grow 50% faster if you have this cover uh and don’t let the the grass wear it up uh this is uh
An interesting thing you see there is a men here and here and and Orono there uh because we have the we have the Nettles and we have this uh that you see everywhere shash they actually seem to at this specific spot you see we don’t do anything about it
They they seem to to compete with the nettles in a in a good way and and this for the uh insects totally lovely and that they came rather late so we have uh we have bees three three hives of bees so this for the the late season it’s very good for the bees
Here is the nursery for the so you propagate some of your plants yes and you graft as well yeah mostly I graft and the this is uh also so from our friend Le we have one uh one hazelnut that is uh uh red red leaves mhm uh and this is nuts from
Uh last year and it looks like the only one is getting red so the pollination of the different nuts that is why you why you can’t trust the nut that is going to be the same interesting the ones up there we we never water R but but here during the RT
I have had to to to water these of course but but not the planted one okay have you heard about the non sticky triple YN yeah yeah uh the first years they are they they they they they say there are no Thorns mhm and that is true for the first year M second
Year uh third year e they they get very very nosty so and and this is you see the these are blooming now this is a local species that we have got from former and and they sometimes they they don’t have time to ripe in in the autn
But this one you so very very productive and extremely sweet it’s thorny yeah it’s thorny but not not not not at all as much as this that the other one they are Thor yes does it have a name or no not that I know of it’s it’s a gift from the neighbor here
Mhm but if we have a a good Autumn I mean then it’s good because then you have two yeah so differentiation that’s all always good it it’s a kind of a honey Rose honey apple Rose I don’t know exactly what kind it is lovely uh sentence from it
There we have some mini kiwi but we don’t have the male and the female together so they are just they’re just Decor decoration and very sweet smell from the male flowers and lots of pollinat here is we we the lyen uh leaves you could also eat in in the
Early spring but this one has been growing too too fast and have you seen this size of before Oh and here is a small malberry that we can pick directly in it for the breakfast mhm but it planted last year it not ready yet we had we had a girl from uh Russia
Here and she said they use use the berries they and and and make some kind of bread oh so they they make a m yeah I have to say your patries look excellent I’m glad you noticed but have you tried this one oh no it’s the first time that they are
Really giving something this year and and I had one we have a summer house in the west coast and and and they looked so nice and there were quite a disappointment when you it’s not the best hey so look at this one we’re actually married under this tree so we we really
Hope that this one will not get the disease it’s such a amazing tree and you see it from downstairs you know it’s h so uh it’s called m the root you you try try the the the the smell of it it’s come with the the early monks
Kirasau or something like that they used that we we don’t use it but but if you read about it it’s it’s supposed to cure the alcoholic sickness mhm the alcoholic Madness or do you remember the little the little peria by the pond same year planted
Same I mean the spot where you place it has has definitely something to do with it peria is the one that that uh needs least uh uh uh uh hours of Sun to write we don’t know yet maybe we’ve tried CER with very bad result and very good result it’s no but
We are we are participant in in a uh organization here so we have a a machine for for real machine for doing uh must uh so that is one of the ideas we have no other product from from our farm I mean we have the honey but we trade we
Don’t sell anything as yet but but when this if if it’s going to give a lot of result then then that is the product that we’re really looking forward to uh we uh we had when we had the sheeps then then we took the the winter uh for for
Str where they had been peeing and and all winter around the trees uh and now I have take only uh you know straw we we buy one or two big ba Bales and we use that no other special fertilizer it’s an Al it took and and it
Seems to be moving here close to this big one to me it is a result of the the the heat wave 2018 because uh also the the fur trees especially Grana you know the gr bar Boron yeah not not actually in in in our our own place but
Very very close to huge area that was totally absolutely but I mean what what do you have to compare with as so few years but but and uh uh the the the thing that is most obvious to me is less snow in the winter because uh we
Go skiing here win winter time but maybe you have five six seven days where where where you have enough snow to go skiing here in the beginning we had half a meter with snow and very cold you asked about the how low it gets we
Could go below low I think 27 was the the lowest we had during the first years it’s it’s not much CL clay it’s more Sandy actually so it’s yeah you you can you can try it so so th this is our small uh annual Garden uh and and this used to be
A something they they were growing for for the cows there so here we have had this dig non dig system so and we we we we don’t need more space than this we are not self-sufficient no but this is good enough for us but this is my big Pride behind
You so I I have uh uh pruned all of them from from start so most of them I did 2014 and planted them 2015 so this is not not uh the way of having different this is a fruit Garden but I I’ll just show you one
Little special extra here now I will not make any more trees so now I will change the trees so so I put in so now I put on Gravenstein here uh this and and then uh selectively uh changing it like that so when I this
2020 and then I take this one in the spring put put here you see this one I think this one so I’m slowly changing it so the the to the the quest here for me is to find the perfect Apple from my youth because I was I was uh raised in
Just three miles from here I was born in in a small city called lindbur and and there there my grandfather made a huge uh uh Apple Garden so I I’m I’m raised in an apple garden and and there was one special Apple that he has
Grafted on a tree and when I know had started to do this grafting yeah of course I go back to the this and and find little piece so I can go on with and I and I come there and there are two trees that are cut down and one of them
Is the one with this so but maybe it’s a solution I talk to my cousin no problem he said I have it so my grandfather grafted it on and then my uncle grafted it for his my cousin’s son and then my cousin come here and we have grafted to so we have
Three generations grafting I don’t know if it is the B because he not giving fruit yet but it’s a good story it’s a good story will you name it if it’s good will you name it n it it has a name it’s car L is the
Name so I mean most of these is thanks to life I was reading his book and oh EST paron that will taste so good and and I mean it’s a total Joy when you when you you can taste your own uh from the your own fruit tree I me it’s lovely it’s totally
Lovely and that is one of the the joys to see how the different trees are developing this is red cenut and actually I can see one here Yes actually I can see several so you see they they are very very beautiful so this is part two of the
The Agro forestry group that we had so after being to to to England we we chose seven different yeah they are the Red Cell not here Pearson’s prolific web price uh very nice but I think uh this is ordinary seller not this graving m m who have digged out the
Hole and and so uh I think this is Pearson’s prolific no no not not yet I I would probably have to sooner or later but yeah I would say webs cob is is my favorite it’s so it’s a very thick uh it’s difficult to to but it’s very very good very very
Good I mean when when we came to to to craford and the first day we had to taste 30 different kinds of Hazel what 30 different and and it was actually a very different taste uh not not as much when we try the walnuts but no so that was totally new experience
No the these have no cages we we planted them these without cages you see around this this is everything uh you know the the the car basket around the roots and uh for the sorc and then you have in the winter I put this stem uh on every tree and then
This for the deers and the Moose mhm for if if the Moose would go in here I mean it would catastrophe he could crash the whole thing down and this one is for the boars the net at the bottom and and and still the rabbits go
In and sometimes the the stem blow away the stem Hood the stem protection yeah blow blows away and immediately the rabbit are there no I’ve not seen anything of that J Japanese uh heartnut yes you know sh sh yeah very very beautiful this one is seems to go
Well this one is not thriving so well I think this is 4 years old now planted 2015 so and and then this is propagated this is from craford these two oh yeah so so they are imported this is not from nut Buccaneer to Buccaneer I think it was have have
You yes it is crafted and and it’s you see it is uh damaged uh in in in the the root itself it is the the grafting these two are grafted and and come from craford and this one is from a nut uh it comes from castle in the south
Of Sweden and I got nuts from loo ifro several of them but no one has uh survived here uhuh I don’t know why see I I cut this with the machine uh the grass and and then we collect the grass like this and we use it mainly for for the annual
Garden and uh last Autumn we we covered all here we had a huge bail with straw and covered everything to to to keep the ug the the weed down seemed to work pretty well yep balam you know it m yeah L nut Garden number
Two and and you see the areas now up up to the the electric line is also our so this all this is ours and and then we used just a small piece here with with the nuts uh this is peon peon so Pi on PE on and they have been
Growing extremely slowly it’s the same peon uh it’s a peon and this is from nuts that that I brought home from from craford three of them has now started to to grow and no sign of nuts yet but this is uh extremely interesting you heard about the monkey
Puzzle yeah and you’re talking about 15 years it’s 30 years and then you will see if it is a male or female sorry male after 30 years no nuts yeah yeah but but this is if if we’re talking about changing the landscape I mean only uh because here here I’m also cutting
The the grass and and I think you you get another to another feeling I mean when you have this and and uh it has not been much done damaged by by either moose or uh deer so I put covered around the the peans in in the Autumn but we have done
Done nothing with the with the H they are planted also 2015 mhm M so and but they were quite good material I mean they had big Roots they were not small species when we got them here so uh eventually you were talking about products uh if if we get along
With the squirrels maybe there will be also hazelnuts for product like this because it it’s uh it’s very easy you plant it and you don’t you don’t have I mean the the the trouble I got with it is cutting the lawn uh but I’m not not doing anything with the
Trees other than going around sniffing and looking at the very nice little flowers that come early in the spring you know them yeah yeah probably we we had a few few nuts because after 2018 uh we had a we had a tremendous uh uh lot of nuts you know
They were so stressed all all all trees were so stressed so they were were giving birth to itself on all levels uh and then we had a few few NS with a small hole in but we it’s nothing that we have uh started to do anything about no yeah mhm so this is
It you were talking about if uh you asked if if we will need to cut them down uh probably probably we will uh if if we want to to to to to to reach the nuts we will probably have to cut them down bend them down like
This they are they are very very easy to bend and then you pluck them yeah exactly when what they when they grow to too thick you will not be able to bend them but it was also I mean like like tasting the first Esther or whatever but
The picking the first nuts it was so original I mean a whole bucket full of nuts it was very very very good feeling I will survive the winter I got some nuts and and this has now a very strange color because this is the Lo local one
Where you have put here b yellow yeah it seems not to be totally healthy do you have problem you see here mhm this one this is uh uh the the deer yeah the horn with with the horn so so that is or or here same he has taken all the bark
Here but it’s okay he get one branch this is the moous garden now you see he he’s eating like this and then he has all these shooting uh branches and then he comes back so even he has to even though he has he’s the Hazel he’s so we are very
Very careful not to cutting this St uh uh last winter he he a few branches that they were they were broken but not not much but but this is how how the the Moose works you know he’s bending them down like this so if he should do this in the
Apple Garden or in the in the Hazel Garden it would be a disaster then he wouldn’t be your friend anymore he would not be my friend anymore I call this the park uh because we have taken down all the fur trees in this so so we we want this to be uh only
The the a park without fur trees you know everywhere here else we are totally surrounded by F trees so this is a sanctuary more than and we get a lot of birds uh s uh that kind of birds that Nest here so it’s also creating another environment for biodiversity
Th this is also a tree from from uh Martin craford it it is uh Maple Leaf uh the Canadian maple that is supposed to give the maple syrup yeah uh that is kind of it’s kind of double I mean you you you take in a totally different species
Here is it is it okay will it be invasive will it work or so I mean we we constantly need to to watch what we are doing like this it seems not to thrive that well in this areas but but what I have tried here uh uhhuh is uh parun PE and and
So they survive I’ve tried with apple they survive one year but Pier seems to survive this is the third year though uh I’ve not seen any fruit yet but uh we will see dang Medan the old uh what do you call it Smith blacksmith blacksmith yes here you have another example that has
Survived but if you look at it it’s it’s uh it’s not healthy you see I mean this this could of course this this year also depend on on the the draft but yeah it’s a try it’s not a way to do it I think here you hear the
Singer I wouldn’t call it mistake but the the the the the challenge the the the biggest challenge is to to find Mark as to find something that really matches this one so you can have something instead I mean you you see we have the Nettles we have
This chashan everything I mean it’s uh it’s very very difficult to to find a crop that that competes with that in a way that you because I’m not at all interested in in weeding uh some all my life no way so as you see here I mean
We let it grow and I cut the the the rose that we we we walk on and and and the rest is but look for instance back here now it’s so many flowers from uh chashan and of course that is good for the Beast and and and and other
Insects but uh if you want to plant something else there then you have a problem yeah yeah yeah even even there behind the stone there we had some men Mina m peppermint but it didn’t work they you you have to to weed so much around it and that is the thing I’m
Least interested in if you have a small place if you’re really interested in in in seeing the the core operation between the spe yes you should try it but if you’re you’re looking for uh uh production I don’t think it’s a way compared to this I mean
What do we have uh in production from this area we’ve had a lot of as I told you before we have had a lot of information we have a lot of good contacts uh it is I mean it’s a a small community that is working with these
Kind of things and and that is the the the main outcome for for me personally in in in this uh so in that sense you should AB absolutely grow uh forest garden and and be part of this community the the thing is to move from 60 square ft to Great production and and
That we have not seen yet we had one participant in our group who is now unfortunately passed on uh he was farmer uh and and he really tried this with Ali ooding and nut trees and and and fruit trees and growing barley and things in between so so he he expanded
The scale but I mean this uh for for uh your own self-sufficiency it could be uh in interesting way to to experiment but don’t expect too much outcome and don’t expect that you should not work why well this is the lugero place you have now visited yeah that the big tour now you
Thank you very much really interesting for